WW2 Seikosha Needs balance Staff and Hairspring

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stroudart
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Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 9:55 am

WW2 Seikosha Needs balance Staff and Hairspring

#1 Post by stroudart » Mon Sep 05, 2016 3:33 am

We have a WW2 Seiko/ Seikosha that needs a balance staff and hairspring. inscribed on the movement bridge. It is 10.5''' [ 23.6mm ] it is of course a manual wind with the seconds at 6. On the dial side H65 is inscribed. On the front of the back cover is engraved Seikiono. 1088 My watchmaker here in Italy believes this movement is a Swiss copy, but searching the "Pink Pages" and other catalogs has been useless.. It is a 3 finger bridge as you can see by the attachment. Your help is greatly and earnestly appreciated.
Regards,
Ben Stroud
Attachments
scan0612.jpg
Movement side Seiko/ Seikosha
scan0612.jpg (38.42 KiB) Viewed 1082 times
scan0613.jpg
Dial side Seiko/ Seikosha
scan0613.jpg (26.67 KiB) Viewed 1082 times

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Ninja01
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Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:00 pm

Re: Seikosha Needs ...

#2 Post by Ninja01 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:00 pm

Hi!

Well, from your movement picture I see this as a "Seiko" [it was actually Hattori Corp. in those days] Calibre 10A (also called a 'banana type' due to the shape of the potences/bridges) which was introduced (according to Japanese sources) in 1946, so that would make it a post-WWII model. They came in 2 jewel-count variants (7 & 10) & yours appears to be the 7.

The 10 calibre family was named as such due to it's diameter as measured in lignes.

Hattori did use Swiss movements and licensed Swiss designs in their own movements in the early & mid 20th century. You can see what I know about the Cal. 10 family of mid-20th Century movements (gleaned from Japanese language sources) @

seikoholics.yuku.com/sreply/739/Seiko-Calibre-10-Family

The pre-WWII cal. 10 was a Moeris design (in the Japanese literature this seems to be often mis-spelled as "Morris"). However, I have seen no specific info on the 10A regarding the base calibre (& any specific Swiss manufacturer/designer) for it.

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Ninja01
Posts: 419
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Re: link to database

#3 Post by Ninja01 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:05 pm

For some reason the link I pasted in (my last response) wasn't the correct format. Try this following one instead:

http://seikoholics.yuku.com/sreply/739/ ... 84H6DUuM0k

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Ninja01
Posts: 419
Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:00 pm

1 more possibility ...

#4 Post by Ninja01 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:28 pm

The "BQ Watch Museum" (Japanese site) does have an entry for a mid-20th century movement they call the "[Seiko-byu-ren] type" and it looks like a cross between the Moeris type [pre-war cal. 10] and the 10A of 1946. It has 3 "banana type" potences, but the bridge architecture is still different from your photo and those of the 10A calibres in the other Japanese sites.

Now, I take the term "byu-ren" used in the BQ entry to be a 'bad' translation of "Buren" (based on the way a Japanese might pronounce that word). So, a search of old Buren designs may be of some use to you... you may find that the 10A is based on a Buren design... if you are lucky. ;)

stroudart
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 9:55 am

Re: WW2 Seikosha Needs balance Staff and Hairspring

#5 Post by stroudart » Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:22 pm

Thank you so much for sharing this vital information. We will certainly search the Buren movements and the Moeris as well. Please, if in the meanwhile you discover any new information do not hesitate to let us know. Our search has been dragging on for months. This is what makes Vintage Watch Collecting so difficult. You have been very kind..
Regards,
Ben Stroud

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Ninja01
Posts: 419
Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:00 pm

Re: ...Seikosha Needs...

#6 Post by Ninja01 » Tue Sep 06, 2016 4:41 pm

stroudart wrote:Thank you so much for sharing this vital information. We will certainly search the Buren movements and the Moeris as well. Please, if in the meanwhile you discover any new information do not hesitate to let us know. Our search has been dragging on for months. This is what makes Vintage Watch Collecting so difficult. You have been very kind..
Regards,
Ben Stroud
OK, you're welcome :)

I'd suggest trying to scour the Yahoo Japan auctions as well, Japanese vintage watch blogs, & to search for Japanese online dealer sites to see if they can be any help at least in identifying what you are looking for (in any better detail). I have links saved for some of these (Japan-based dealers & blogs), but they change over time & a few that I just tried are no longer live ... but I'm sure there are others you can find!

Finding parts for vintage Japanese watches (even those much newer than yours) of all kinds is quite a challenge. Seiko/Hattori policy seems to have been that "support" (parts availability, etc) for its models only was provided for 10 years. So many collectors of vintage '60s, '70s, and even '80s model Seikos have to be creative in finding replacement parts which are often long "out of stock" in today's official Seiko corporate facilities. Some parts have been re-created, others can be found in stocks of retired private watchmakers now being offered on venues such as eBay & Japan Yahoo auctions around the world.

stroudart
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 9:55 am

Re: ...Seikosha Needs...

#7 Post by stroudart » Tue Sep 06, 2016 7:17 pm

Ninja01 wrote:
stroudart wrote:Thank you so much for sharing this vital information. We will certainly search the Buren movements and the Moeris as well. Please, if in the meanwhile you discover any new information do not hesitate to let us know. Our search has been dragging on for months. This is what makes Vintage Watch Collecting so difficult. You have been very kind..
Regards,
Ben Stroud
OK, you're welcome :)

I'd suggest trying to scour the Yahoo Japan auctions as well, Japanese vintage watch blogs, & to search for Japanese online dealer sites to see if they can be any help at least in identifying what you are looking for (in any better detail). I have links saved for some of these (Japan-based dealers & blogs), but they change over time & a few that I just tried are no longer live ... but I'm sure there are others you can find!

Finding parts for vintage Japanese watches (even those much newer than yours) of all kinds is quite a challenge. Seiko/Hattori policy seems to have been that "support" (parts availability, etc) for its models only was provided for 10 years. So many collectors of vintage '60s, '70s, and even '80s model Seikos have to be creative in finding replacement parts which are often long "out of stock" in today's official Seiko corporate facilities. Some parts have been re-created, others can be found in stocks of retired private watchmakers now being offered on venues such as eBay & Japan Yahoo auctions around the world.

veritas123
Posts: 154
Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:53 pm

Re: WW2 Seikosha Needs balance Staff and Hairspring

#8 Post by veritas123 » Thu Nov 03, 2016 2:41 pm

Do you have any ideas as to where I could find a staff for the 10 series ?
The only listing I can find anywhere is for the 10 1/2 Ligne C and CD

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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