Vintage Watch Forums

Vintage Collector’s Site for Discussion
Home
Hamilton Watches for Sale
It is currently Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:29 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2016 1:01 am
Posts: 116
Location: Germany
Thank you all for your input!

@veritas123: thanks for the number! I immediately ordered one!

Adam: thanks for your offer - but I really was fast in ordering. Before your offer was made….

@kastner: ah, so it's a "Cadet", no "Comet"? Interesting.

Regards

Martin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:58 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:02 pm
Posts: 116
Location: Sheepless in Seattle
kastner wrote:
Far be it from me to disagree with Gary and Barney on a name, but why the Comet? If you look at Mike's 1940s book on page 216 there's a front view of the Cadet that to my eye looks exactly like what Martin and I have. Even the dial is the same. What am I missing?

Who knows Jason... :lol: This probably stumped the experts. Seriously I cannot tell the difference. Oh my aging eyes!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:28 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:02 pm
Posts: 116
Location: Sheepless in Seattle
GaryM wrote:
kastner wrote:
Far be it from me to disagree with Gary and Barney on a name, but why the Comet? If you look at Mike's 1940s book on page 216 there's a front view of the Cadet that to my eye looks exactly like what Martin and I have. Even the dial is the same. What am I missing?

Who knows Jason... :lol: This probably stumped the experts. Seriously I cannot tell the difference. Oh my aging eyes!


Looking at those lugs will get ya every time. Yes on p210 the Comet doesn't show the flared out lugs like the Cadet. So be it.

FWIW - The "edit your post" has gone missing here at this forum. Either that or my aging eyes are at it again. :evil:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:57 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 7:47 pm
Posts: 12
Quote:
Looking at those lugs will get ya every time. Yes on p210 the Comet doesn't show the flared out lugs like the Cadet. So be it.


There is something going on with the Comet lugs but the angle of the picture makes it hard to see exactly what. If there hadn't been the Cadet just a few pages later I could certainly go with calling this watch a Comet.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:33 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:30 pm
Posts: 116
Location: Germany
The Cadet has lugs which are remaining same width from the bezel towards the springbar ends whereas the lugs of the Comet become wider from the bezel towards the strap. This is to me the most obvious difference. The dials seem to have been changed during the different years of production, whereas the case is a unique identifier for each model.
Unfortunately I do not have Mikes book with me, I am on travel this week.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:54 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 237
Kastner is correct... it's a Curvex Cadet, not a Curvex Comet

The biggest mismatch is the style number. A Comet has a 440-544 Style Number
The Comet's bezel is thinner between the lugs than this watch

Here is a Curvex Comet for comparison
Attachment:
1946 Curvex Comet 03.JPG
1946 Curvex Comet 03.JPG [ 392.27 KiB | Viewed 328 times ]

(more photos can be found here -- 1946 Curvex Comet)

Nice ID Jason!

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2016 1:01 am
Posts: 116
Location: Germany
Hi Mike,

thanks for confirming, that my Curvex actually is a Cadet, no Comet. Most interesting!

Regarding the box: any chance, that the box could match the watch?

Best regards

Martin


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 9:37 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 237
Hmmm... I don't know boxes and the history of when they went from one style to the next.

I'll say it "does not look inconsistent" with boxes from that era. Gruen had gotten away with that blue colored box they sold the first Curvexes by the time your watch was sold.

When you order a crystal, be sure you use the 440-449 style number rather than the model name :-)

I have located a thin glass Watchcraft crystal that should fit your watch. If you are interested, please PM me.

Attachment:
Watchcraft crystal for 440 449.jpg
Watchcraft crystal for 440 449.jpg [ 54.63 KiB | Viewed 325 times ]

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 11:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:30 pm
Posts: 116
Location: Germany
Sorry to say, but I still disagree. Mike, could you please take a look into your source material and compare it with your book. All the ads I have show to me that this is not the Cadet but a Comet. I might be wrong but I have a number of ads showing the picture match the Comet.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449 (Curvex Cadet)
PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 8:30 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 237
Perhaps we're talking about two different Curvex Cadets?

Mr. Kastner pointed us towards an image found in the Decade Series book, The 1940s on page 216 of a Curvex Cadet. Best I can tell, it's the ONLY image of this specific model of Curvex Cadet, advertised in 1947. That's the best feature of these Decade Series books, obscure models are often found only here.

As previously stated, not only are the cases a match, but so is the dial. I think it was a great ID.

The area I would like to direct your attention to is between the lugs. On the Cadet there is an "extra bit of metal" between the lugs. The Curvex Comet does not have this extra bit of metal.

I have highlighted these portions of the bezel in yellow on the original photo of the watch that was in the initial post.
Attachment:
Curvex 440 449 with overlay.jpg
Curvex 440 449 with overlay.jpg [ 204.24 KiB | Viewed 314 times ]


These highlighted areas on the bezel are not present in the Curvex Comet (on pages 186 and 210 of The 1940s book).

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:54 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:30 pm
Posts: 116
Location: Germany
Mike,

I get you. The problem is that I have a number of Cadet pictures from 1947, all seem to show different watches. And yes, you are right, one is showing the watch we are talking about. The extra metal between the lugs is definitely missing on the Comet.

Here are my 1947 Cadet pictures, as you can see they all show totally different watches:


Attachments:
The_Neosho_Daily_News_Wed__Dec_17__1947_.jpg
The_Neosho_Daily_News_Wed__Dec_17__1947_.jpg [ 419.58 KiB | Viewed 347 times ]
The_Corpus_Christi_Caller_Times_Tue__Dec_16__1947_.jpg
The_Corpus_Christi_Caller_Times_Tue__Dec_16__1947_.jpg [ 126.96 KiB | Viewed 347 times ]
The_Town_Talk_Tue__Apr_29__1947_.jpg
The_Town_Talk_Tue__Apr_29__1947_.jpg [ 161.67 KiB | Viewed 347 times ]
The_Town_Talk_Tue__Sep_30__1947_.jpg
The_Town_Talk_Tue__Sep_30__1947_.jpg [ 228.54 KiB | Viewed 347 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 1:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 237
I'm not sure what to tell you other than you should write a letter to Gruen complaining about model-name reuse. ;)

So far, the ONLY match to the watch originally posted, the 440-449, is the image Kastner pointed us all to. It's the one from The 1940s book and matches the image you've posted from Dec 16th 1947.

I would bet money that if one was to overlay the image of the Curvex Cadet from the newspaper with a photo of the watch, the dimensions would match and the dial figures would as well.

We also know already that the Curvex Comet has a style number of 440-544, not 440-449.

I have only seen one image match the photo of the 440-449 watch posted and that's the Curvex Cadet advertised on Dec 16th 1947. I haven't found anything else that matches.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:50 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2016 1:01 am
Posts: 116
Location: Germany
MikeTheWatchGuy wrote:

I would bet money that if one was to overlay the image of the Curvex Cadet from the newspaper with a photo of the watch, the dimensions would match and the dial figures would as well.


Mike,

just for the fun of it, I took a straight front photo and brought it to the same dimensions as the 1947 ad:


Attachment:
Curvex_440_05_576x768.jpg
Curvex_440_05_576x768.jpg [ 98.42 KiB | Viewed 318 times ]


Attachment:
Comp_Ad_440-449.jpg
Comp_Ad_440-449.jpg [ 76.52 KiB | Viewed 318 times ]
Seems, this IS a match!


MikeTheWatchGuy wrote:

When you order a crystal, be sure you use the 440-449 style number rather than the model name :-)

I have located a thin glass Watchcraft crystal that should fit your watch. If you are interested, please PM me.


Thanks for your kind offer, but I have a crystal already. Should fit the 440-449.



Attachment:
Curvex_440_10_1024x768.jpg
Curvex_440_10_1024x768.jpg [ 105.06 KiB | Viewed 318 times ]


Best regards

Martin
P.S: This little Gruen was my first vintage watch I bought back in 1994 or ’95, when the prices for vintage watches were crazy high in Germany….


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2016 7:51 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 237
Thanks for the additional photo.

I took the photo of your watch and the advertisement illustration and superimposed them. It appears that this ad was drawn using a photo of an actual watch as the dimensions fit perfectly. I did not distort the illustration when I resized it to match the photograph.

The illustration is colored red in this exercise.

You can read more about this practice and see other examples in the Reference Section of GruenWristwatches site.


Attachment:
Curvex Cadet Superimposed.jpg
Curvex Cadet Superimposed.jpg [ 305.8 KiB | Viewed 316 times ]

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:11 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2016 1:01 am
Posts: 116
Location: Germany
Again, thank you all for identifying my Cadet! Meanwhile, my watchmaker managed it to replace the crystal - now, it looks much better.

Attachment:
Curvex_440_11_576x768.jpg
Curvex_440_11_576x768.jpg [ 79.3 KiB | Viewed 158 times ]


Attachment:
Curvex_440_12_576x768.jpg
Curvex_440_12_576x768.jpg [ 63.46 KiB | Viewed 158 times ]


Best regards

Martin


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Terms of Service