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 Post subject: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2016 1:29 am 
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Have a Curvex grade 440, style number 449, Wadsworth case number G770201 with some questions. Hope, somebody can answer.


Attachment:
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Curvex_440_03_872x768.jpg
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Curvex_440_09_1024x767.jpg
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First question: for some reasons the watch received a bevelled crystal what I don’t like that much and I’m looking for a normal crystal. Can somebody tell me, what crystal would match?

Second question: the box. Is it a match or what type of box would be a match? Gruen boxes are a science of its own….

Last question: did the watch had a name?

Best regards

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2016 9:00 am 
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I have this same watch, case number G768916.

My watch has a curved crystal with the edges slightly sloped from the top to where they meet the case. It does not have a "peak" like yours appears to have. I don't have a crystal number for you but I've found Kurt Ryerson to be an excellent source for crystals.

No idea about the case box it was sold with. I've got a half dozen different styles of boxes and that's not even scratching the surface of what's out there.

As for the name, the Wadsworth case method of dating in Dating a Gruen Wristwatch from a Wadsworth Case Serial Number by Jack Wood, the G76 and G77 for our watches puts them at 1946/1947 and in Mike Barnett's book http://www.lulu.com/shop/mike-barnett-and-shari-barnett/gruen-the-1940s-a-decade-of-watches-from-the-daily-news/paperback/product-20950013.html there's a watch called the Cadet advertised in 1947 that looks like ours.

I will note that according to Mike Barnett and Barry Cooper's article

http://www.gruenwristwatches.com/resources/Style_Number_Article/Revolutionary%20New%20Gruen%20Dating%20Technique.pdf

the style number of 449 first appeared in 1941. I think that's the biggest disconnect on a year that I've run across.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2016 12:56 pm 
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If you don't find a crystal, let me know the dimensions as I have tons of Gruen crystals.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2016 4:36 pm 
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I'm showing three styles of crystal for the 440-449 Gruen . None are a gabled crystal.

There is a standard thickness Military ( bent ) and a High Profile Military ( small side walls that elevate the top ) as you currently have but without the gable. Just a smooth curved surface. The one most shown in the various catalogs is the standard thickness.

Which one is correct becomes a matter of personal choice.

All the above are in glass.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:56 pm 
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I believe this is a Curvex Comet. Note that the dial was redone at some point in it's lifetime. 1947 give or take for the year based on the simple "G7" prefix.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:32 am 
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Gary is absolutely right The watch shown is the Curvex Comet, introduced late 1946 and having been available until at least late 1949. It should not have had a bevelled crystal.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:52 am 
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Thank you all for your contribution!

Ah, it’s a “Comet”, I see. Yes I know, the original crystal did not have a gable – it does since a year or so, when somebody, who paid for the repair had the brilliant idea to wear it for a week…. :roll: it dropped on the floor….. and he cared for a new crystal……. When I bought it 22 years ago, it was alright with the crystal… :evil:

Nobody has a crystal number (e. g. GS xyz) or the like? Too bad, but I’m not in a hurry.

Thanks also for dating it. Yes, the dial isn’t in best condition – but as it was my very first vintage watch, I’ll leave it as is.

Best regards

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:47 pm 
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Sorry for the omission

GS CMX 358-25


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:08 am 
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I'm sure I have a plastic crystal if you still need one.

Let me know.

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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:16 pm 
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Far be it from me to disagree with Gary and Barney on a name, but why the Comet? If you look at Mike's 1940s book on page 216 there's a front view of the Cadet that to my eye looks exactly like what Martin and I have. Even the dial is the same. What am I missing?


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 9:20 pm 
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Thank you all for your input!

@veritas123: thanks for the number! I immediately ordered one!

Adam: thanks for your offer - but I really was fast in ordering. Before your offer was made….

@kastner: ah, so it's a "Cadet", no "Comet"? Interesting.

Regards

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:58 am 
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kastner wrote:
Far be it from me to disagree with Gary and Barney on a name, but why the Comet? If you look at Mike's 1940s book on page 216 there's a front view of the Cadet that to my eye looks exactly like what Martin and I have. Even the dial is the same. What am I missing?

Who knows Jason... :lol: This probably stumped the experts. Seriously I cannot tell the difference. Oh my aging eyes!


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:28 am 
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GaryM wrote:
kastner wrote:
Far be it from me to disagree with Gary and Barney on a name, but why the Comet? If you look at Mike's 1940s book on page 216 there's a front view of the Cadet that to my eye looks exactly like what Martin and I have. Even the dial is the same. What am I missing?

Who knows Jason... :lol: This probably stumped the experts. Seriously I cannot tell the difference. Oh my aging eyes!


Looking at those lugs will get ya every time. Yes on p210 the Comet doesn't show the flared out lugs like the Cadet. So be it.

FWIW - The "edit your post" has gone missing here at this forum. Either that or my aging eyes are at it again. :evil:


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:57 am 
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Quote:
Looking at those lugs will get ya every time. Yes on p210 the Comet doesn't show the flared out lugs like the Cadet. So be it.


There is something going on with the Comet lugs but the angle of the picture makes it hard to see exactly what. If there hadn't been the Cadet just a few pages later I could certainly go with calling this watch a Comet.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:33 am 
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The Cadet has lugs which are remaining same width from the bezel towards the springbar ends whereas the lugs of the Comet become wider from the bezel towards the strap. This is to me the most obvious difference. The dials seem to have been changed during the different years of production, whereas the case is a unique identifier for each model.
Unfortunately I do not have Mikes book with me, I am on travel this week.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:54 am 
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Kastner is correct... it's a Curvex Cadet, not a Curvex Comet

The biggest mismatch is the style number. A Comet has a 440-544 Style Number
The Comet's bezel is thinner between the lugs than this watch

Here is a Curvex Comet for comparison
Attachment:
1946 Curvex Comet 03.JPG
1946 Curvex Comet 03.JPG [ 392.27 KiB | Viewed 340 times ]

(more photos can be found here -- 1946 Curvex Comet)

Nice ID Jason!

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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:45 am 
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Hi Mike,

thanks for confirming, that my Curvex actually is a Cadet, no Comet. Most interesting!

Regarding the box: any chance, that the box could match the watch?

Best regards

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 9:37 am 
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Hmmm... I don't know boxes and the history of when they went from one style to the next.

I'll say it "does not look inconsistent" with boxes from that era. Gruen had gotten away with that blue colored box they sold the first Curvexes by the time your watch was sold.

When you order a crystal, be sure you use the 440-449 style number rather than the model name :-)

I have located a thin glass Watchcraft crystal that should fit your watch. If you are interested, please PM me.

Attachment:
Watchcraft crystal for 440 449.jpg
Watchcraft crystal for 440 449.jpg [ 54.63 KiB | Viewed 337 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449
PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 11:41 am 
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Sorry to say, but I still disagree. Mike, could you please take a look into your source material and compare it with your book. All the ads I have show to me that this is not the Cadet but a Comet. I might be wrong but I have a number of ads showing the picture match the Comet.


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 Post subject: Re: Questions regarding a Curvex 440-449 (Curvex Cadet)
PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 8:30 am 
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Perhaps we're talking about two different Curvex Cadets?

Mr. Kastner pointed us towards an image found in the Decade Series book, The 1940s on page 216 of a Curvex Cadet. Best I can tell, it's the ONLY image of this specific model of Curvex Cadet, advertised in 1947. That's the best feature of these Decade Series books, obscure models are often found only here.

As previously stated, not only are the cases a match, but so is the dial. I think it was a great ID.

The area I would like to direct your attention to is between the lugs. On the Cadet there is an "extra bit of metal" between the lugs. The Curvex Comet does not have this extra bit of metal.

I have highlighted these portions of the bezel in yellow on the original photo of the watch that was in the initial post.
Attachment:
Curvex 440 449 with overlay.jpg
Curvex 440 449 with overlay.jpg [ 204.24 KiB | Viewed 326 times ]


These highlighted areas on the bezel are not present in the Curvex Comet (on pages 186 and 210 of The 1940s book).

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